WHO Poll
Q: 2022/23 You are the Chairman what do you do with Moyes?
a. Stick with him obviously, he's delivered two good seasons back to back and will see us out of this dip in form
33%
  
b. If we're still lingering around the bottom three by the start of the WC then that's the time to get rid
29%
  
c. What are we waiting for 2 wins in the last 20 PL games is reason enough to sack him, go now
32%
  
d. I've just got my new Orange & White 3rd Kit with Moyesinho on the back, I can't wait to wear it down to the supermarket, they call me Mr West Ham around here
7%
  



Stubbo 8:30 Sat Sep 3
Is football actually corrupt?
Decisions like today's certainly make me question this. The volume of money involved not just in the domestic game but in betting syndicates in the far East where billions upon billions are bet in the outcome of each match, controlled by unanswerable faceless individuals in the VAR room, as well as relatively lowly paid referees, with stables of players in both teams answering more to their agents than their clubs, with agents often having players on both sides of a match.

Given the variables, and with the all too common outcomes that are seen where everyone watching can see one logical decision and yet those 'involved' decide it should go the other way...it would almost be amazing if the game wasn't intrinsically corrupt.

If it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck, and quacks like a duck... it's more than likely a duck. Football IMO is as crooked as any sport out there.

Replies - Newest Posts First (Show In Chronological Order)

jack flash 2:18 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
The very fact that neither Moyes nor Rice are not going to be facing any disciplinary action for telling the truth tells you everything you need to know
Clearly the officials know they've got it completely and utterly wrong and everyone in football (with the exception of Graeme Souness) knows that they got it wrong (and for the umpteenth time against West Ham)
Although this was the worst ever example of VAR getting it completely wrong there are incidents of incorrect decisions made using VAR nearly every week
The statistical fact that very few of these decisions are against the Sky 6 has got to be down to mere incompetence. It's corruption and it needs urgently sorted out
It won't be though
Is there anyone who seriously believes we'll get any more than a pat on the head and a 'Sorry mate we got it wrong this time' and then we all carry on as before?

jack flash 2:17 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
The very fact that neither Moyes nor Rice are not going to be facing any disciplinary action for telling the truth tells you everything you need to know
Clearly the officials know they've got it completely and utterly wrong and everyone in football (with the exception of Graeme Souness) knows that they got it wrong (and for the umpteenth time against West Ham)
Although this was the worst ever example of VAR getting it completely wrong there are incidents of incorrect decisions made using VAR nearly every week
The statistical fact that very few of these decisions are against the Sky 6 has got to be down to mere incompetence. It's corruption and it needs urgently sorted out
It won't be though
Is there anyone who seriously believes we'll get any more than a pat on the head and a 'Sorry mate we got it wrong this time' and then we all carry on as before?

Bernie 11:10 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
Football at the very top of FIFA and UEFA is corrupt and has been for decades, but at VAR level in independent games its just incompetence, there's far too many refs/assistants/var refs/administrators etc involved for the level of consistent corruption required to affect individual games.

VAR makes the level of incompetence worse as all it does is shift one persons opinion onto anothers.

VAR should only be used for definitive black and white decisions, offside, you're either on or off, the end. If the tech isn't ready yet to get offsides perfect then don't use till it is.

Leave everything else to the ref and get on with it

Mike Oxsaw 9:47 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
claypole 10:53 Mon Sep 5

It won't be Leicester - they're still on probation for having the audacity to take the best seat at the top table a while back.

A woman scorned would be more lenient.

Rusta 12:23 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
It wasn’t just the big obvious decisions against Chelsea either. Watch it again there’s loads of things they got away with.

I just don’t think it’s possible to be that incompetent when they are trained for this specific job when the average footy pub going fan can see it.

So something else has to be at play here

Rusta 12:23 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
It wasn’t just the big obvious decisions against Chelsea either. Watch it again there’s loads of things they got away with.

I just don’t think it’s possible to be that incompetent when they are trained for this specific job when the average footy pub going fan can see it.

So something else has to be at play here

threesixty 12:01 Tue Sep 6
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
This is classic “who watches the watchmen”

The refs in England all know each other and have a siege mentality. As they should do being that they get vilified every week. No one really wants to be a ref these days.

So in this group, which ref is going to tell the other ref they are wrong, bringing all the consequences of being wrong that that will bring?

You can’t have one set of the group (the VAR people) policing the other part of the group (refs on the pitch) on controversial positions.

Especially as the VAR people have the extra cameras, the slow motion etc to call out the decision. If you don’t back the VAR people it will look like their clowns. Which is why hardly any ref will not go with their decision (or their lead).

To solve it the VAR people can not be anything to do with the other refs. They need to be completely separate. It would be better that they were all ex-players even. That would even it up and remove the bollocks.

Any institution that polices itself will always be corrupt. It’s impossible for it not to be.

David L 11:12 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
It was, apparently, the position of the player's shadows, that the VAR team decided on as they couldn't make their minds up. Cunts.

claypole 10:53 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
I wonder what team Gillett has been told must win? Madleys task is a bit easier

Takashi Miike 10:28 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
hahaha, fucking rubbing the fans noses in it. why don't they add hackett as 4th official

Sven Roeder 10:06 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
And Jarred Gillett has been pronoted fron VAR at Stamford Bridge to referee Leicester City v Aston Villa. With Mike Dean as his VAR.

claret on my shirt 9:57 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
I see Madleys punishment for Saturday is to get the Liverpool / Wolves game at the weekend, they are just taking the piss now

pdbis 7:05 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
There are a lot of managers who tell their players to do all it takes to win matches which includes cheating.

ted fenton 5:49 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
Would be a nice touch if Bookies would now pay out to all those that had West Ham or Newcastle in their bets !

I won't hold my breath.

Cost me £50

nychammer 5:46 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
The problem with VAR is that while it shows the black and white of situation and is beneficial in deciding fairly on an incident the majority of the time, there will always be those scenarios where even on a camera a referee will still have the opportunity to apply their own read and if there will be an opportunity to rule in favor of a team they have some internal bias for or against or worst if there is money involved, assuming we are going to go with such a conspiracy theories.

The one against us shows how the referee took that to an extreme, to decide that our goal should not stand based on what I do not know. There is no way you could see an opening to award a foul there, but it was done hurriedly, has been exposed for what it is and somebody needs to pay for this, because you simply cannot have a man in a room making wrong and consequential decisions based on their own whims and not the facts of the situation.

eusebiovic 5:21 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
Hermit

I made a mistake with the use of language.

Yes the betting industry is highly regulated but compared to how it used to be with the blacked out windows of the betting shop and restricted hours it's kind of an unofficial deregulation compared to the old system was my point.

That does leave the door open for organized crime to get up to all sorts of skullduggery on the fringes but on a much more global scale due to the internet.

That is the Pandora's Box that is then impossible to put the lid back on.

That was what I was getting at.

VirginiaHam 5:12 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
Percy Dalton 2:07 Sun Sep 4

Tuchel had 2 choices.

a) Claim it was a clear foul, and condone Mendy's diving and cheating.

b) Say he doesn't like diving and cheating, and risk losing the dressing room.

Mike Oxsaw 5:06 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
tonka 4:10 Mon Sep 5

Thanks. I understand - I think - where you're coming from, but some decisions are binary and would lend themselves very well to AI - offsides, for instance, ball crossing the line, (maybe) foul throws. No reason why, over time, AI can't pick up on simulation - real life referees need to learn continuously and aren't infallible.

Clearly - as you point out - many decisions are subjective, but that shouldn't preclude using AI as an assistant at Stockley Park for where it can be used.

tonka 4:10 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
Mike Oxsaw wrote...

Because current AI or ML isn't subjective. It would be a binary decision. In order to interpret the rules of football, some subjectivity is required (accidental handball etc) In order for AI to run VAR you would have to create a neural network of the perfect referee, and allow it to access the biometric data from all the players, so it would be able to determine who is cheating, surprised by decisions, injured, faking etc.
These are data points and signals that currently we expect the on field referee to see in order to make a decision.

Hermit Road 4:02 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
"What isn't regulated is the negative social side effects which result from it as you well know.

But it's all about splitting hairs and making excuses for the system.

Which you are fantastic at doing at every opportunity."


All I said was that the betting industry is highly regulated in response to your statement that it had been completely deregulated.

Part of the regulations also compel betting companies to make provision for people who are impacted by gambling addiction so even this; "What isn't regulated is the negative social side effects" is inaccurate.

I don't know why you said something false in the first place and I don't understand why you don't just hold your hands up when it is shown to be completely false. It's not that big a deal. You thought it was completely deregulated, it turns out that it is highly regulated. Why dig your heels in on something like that?

Mike Oxsaw 3:42 Mon Sep 5
Re: Is football actually corrupt?
I've asked this before, but why can't AI be used for (some) VAR decisions?

If it's good enough to calculate if YOUR credit is good enough for a loan/mortgage, it's well good enough to make an offside/contact call.

Is nobody down in the basement teaching their Spectrum ZX the offside rule?

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