The Official Politics Thread (enter at your own risk)

[Come On You Irons]

There. Resident WHO political commentators and gurus can knock yourselves out in here and conduct your endless bickering. All other threads will be locked.

[Nutsin]

If you believe that coming out of the ECHR will have any impact on the way the state runs the country then you deserve to be incarcerated into Barley Lane hospital...for life.

These "barriers" are not being compiled by the government (either colour) but by the state in an attempt to get what it wants.

"Doubling down" against something I never claimed doesn't actually enhance your defence here, at all.

Yes you did, you conceded that Brexit got through in spite of the States attempts to stop it. Your words not mine.

Another referendum getting through would once again prove your  theory wrong.

I do agree that the state is a problem but they are not unbeatable. History has proven that.

Change is coming you’ll see. And the state won’t be a match against the will of the people.

It was a challenge to get about half the population off their arses and vote in the Brexit referendum. Apathy in the UK (God save the Queen) has gone up an order of magnitude or two since then, as any observant resident will testify, so an ECHR referendum is more likely to go down in history as a vote with the lowest turn-out ever than delivering "the will of the people".

That's not "defeatist", that's simply reading society, which anybody can do.

Had Brexit been accepted at the time by the state, then it would have sailed through effortlessly, but "the will of the people" decided otherwise, it seems.

Your arguments get more and more "6th-formy" by the minute. The state, as I said, holds all the aces, all the power, and cannot be voted out.

If by 6 th for my you mean right, I’ll agree.

Currently the state is happy with masse immigration and the rape of the children.

Tat will change once the ECHR is removed and your entire argument will be proven wrong again.

Your argument has a lot of waffle and nonsense. It sounds like you’re arguing with yourself.

[Mike Oxsaw]

Sorry, I thought we were having a 2 way conversation.

You said that nothing would be achieved by the electorate. I simply gave you your example of Brexit and doubled down with Farage clips on ECHR and his plans on the ECHR referendum as an example of what will change.

Coming out of the ECHR removes the barriers currently being used as an excuse by the UK Gov’t as to why people have to live in fear for their kids and women.

If succesful I’d say that’s a big change and a big win for the people and another big loss for the state. Wouldn’t you?

If you believe that coming out of the ECHR will have any impact on the way the state runs the country then you deserve to be incarcerated into Barley Lane hospital...for life.

These "barriers" are not being compiled by the government (either colour) but by the state in an attempt to get what it wants.

"Doubling down" against something I never claimed doesn't actually enhance your defence here, at all.

Yes you did, you conceded that Brexit got through in spite of the States attempts to stop it. Your words not mine.

Another referendum getting through would once again prove your  theory wrong.

I do agree that the state is a problem but they are not unbeatable. History has proven that.

Change is coming you’ll see. And the state won’t be a match against the will of the people.

It was a challenge to get about half the population off their arses and vote in the Brexit referendum. Apathy in the UK (God save the Queen) has gone up an order of magnitude or two since then, as any observant resident will testify, so an ECHR referendum is more likely to go down in history as a vote with the lowest turn-out ever than delivering "the will of the people".

That's not "defeatist", that's simply reading society, which anybody can do.

Had Brexit been accepted at the time by the state, then it would have sailed through effortlessly, but "the will of the people" decided otherwise, it seems.

Your arguments get more and more "6th-formy" by the minute. The state, as I said, holds all the aces, all the power, and cannot be voted out.

[Nutsin]

So at what point did I (that's me, that is, not you) mention the ECHR and "deporting savages"?

Sorry, I thought we were having a 2 way conversation.

You said that nothing would be achieved by the electorate. I simply gave you your example of Brexit and doubled down with Farage clips on ECHR and his plans on the ECHR referendum as an example of what will change.

Coming out of the ECHR removes the barriers currently being used as an excuse by the UK Gov’t as to why people have to live in fear for their kids and women.

If succesful I’d say that’s a big change and a big win for the people and another big loss for the state. Wouldn’t you?

If you believe that coming out of the ECHR will have any impact on the way the state runs the country then you deserve to be incarcerated into Barley Lane hospital...for life.

These "barriers" are not being compiled by the government (either colour) but by the state in an attempt to get what it wants.

"Doubling down" against something I never claimed doesn't actually enhance your defence here, at all.

Yes you did, you conceded that Brexit got through in spite of the States attempts to stop it. Your words not mine.

Another referendum getting through would once again prove your  theory wrong.

I do agree that the state is a problem but they are not unbeatable. History has proven that.

Change is coming you’ll see. And the state won’t be a match against the will of the people.

[Mike Oxsaw]

I found the video clip I was looking for. The one explaining the terms of the ECHR treaty. I thought you’d find it useful. It’s what’s currently being referenced to as a reason as to why we can’t deport these savages.

It’s kind of important.

So at what point did I (that's me, that is, not you) mention the ECHR and "deporting savages"?

Sorry, I thought we were having a 2 way conversation.

You said that nothing would be achieved by the electorate. I simply gave you your example of Brexit and doubled down with Farage clips on ECHR and his plans on the ECHR referendum as an example of what will change.

Coming out of the ECHR removes the barriers currently being used as an excuse by the UK Gov’t as to why people have to live in fear for their kids and women.

If succesful I’d say that’s a big change and a big win for the people and another big loss for the state. Wouldn’t you?

If you believe that coming out of the ECHR will have any impact on the way the state runs the country then you deserve to be incarcerated into Barley Lane hospital...for life.

These "barriers" are not being compiled by the government (either colour) but by the state in an attempt to get what it wants.

"Doubling down" against something I never claimed doesn't actually enhance your defence here, at all.

[Nutsin]

Come on then, what is it that you've "found", not "what do I sound like" (to you)?

I found the video clip I was looking for. The one explaining the terms of the ECHR treaty. I thought you’d find it useful. It’s what’s currently being referenced to as a reason as to why we can’t deport these savages.

It’s kind of important.

So at what point did I (that's me, that is, not you) mention the ECHR and "deporting savages"?

Sorry, I thought we were having a 2 way conversation.

You said that nothing would be achieved by the electorate. I simply gave you your example of Brexit and doubled down with Farage clips on ECHR and his plans on the ECHR referendum as an example of what will change.

Coming out of the ECHR removes the barriers currently being used as an excuse by the UK Gov’t as to why people have to live in fear for their kids and women.

If succesful I’d say that’s a big change and a big win for the people and another big loss for the state. Wouldn’t you?

[Mike Oxsaw]

You sound like a Democrat talking about the Deep state. I’ve heard it all before mate. 

Come on then, what is it that you've "found", not "what do I sound like" (to you)?

I found the video clip I was looking for. The one explaining the terms of the ECHR treaty. I thought you’d find it useful. It’s what’s currently being referenced to as a reason as to why we can’t deport these savages.

It’s kind of important.

So at what point did I (that's me, that is, not you) mention the ECHR and "deporting savages"?

[Nutsin]

What, exactly, is it you've "found", and how does it relate to my claim that the state holds all the aces when it comes to actually running the country?

You sound like a Democrat talking about the Deep state. I’ve heard it all before mate. 

Come on then, what is it that you've "found", not "what do I sound like" (to you)?

I found the video clip I was looking for. The one explaining the terms of the ECHR treaty. I thought you’d find it useful. It’s what’s currently being referenced to as a reason as to why we can’t deport these savages.

It’s kind of important.

[Nutsin]

 

Allow me to correct you.

Whatever flavour of government is in power, it is the state, not the government that actually implements the government's policies - but only if they approve; just look at the effort they put in to getting/trying to get Brexit overturned. They're still smarting like crazy from that one - how very dare the population have a say in how the state runs the country?

If the state (Be it the MoD, MoJ, Home Office, HMRC, etc.) decides to not play along, nothing happens.

 

I disagree, Brexit proves the point. A referendum on the ECHR would be a second example.
Don’t underestimate the power of the people.

 

Brexit only got through because the people were pissed off with it dominating the headlines.

Boris Johnson caught that sentiment and got into power on the back of it, but even then the state was using every trick in the book - and then some - to try and thwart him; they came pretty close at times, too.

It wasn't "people power" that got Brexit over the line, it was simply a case of media fatigue - nobody wanted to hear about it 24/7 any more - either way.

I doubt that many those being asked to partake in a referendum for leaving the ECHR have the slightest clue as to what it does, so calling one would only create a tsunami of disinformation from both sides and, most probably a result not too dissimilar to the Brexit result and it's following state encouraged shenanigans.

Politicians are not the answer. Curbing the power of the state is.

 

 

Wasn’t it the people who voted for Brexit?

Kids are being raped en masse and women murdered and assaulted on a daily basis, I think people will be motivated to put an end to it. Especially parents and women.

According to you all we need is the same game plan of creating media fatigue to get a referendum on leaving the ECHR over line. Shouldn’t be too difficult. 

I would think it would be an easy sell to the public. You could call it “Human rights for women and children” as a campaign.

You know Farage won’t back down.


So I disagree with you, completely! I see mass deportations in the future and the human rights of Brits brought to the forefront.

Britain first is long over due. Farage can expect the full backing of the USA too. 

[Mike Oxsaw]

Here you go Oxsaw, I found it. 

What, exactly, is it you've "found", and how does it relate to my claim that the state holds all the aces when it comes to actually running the country?

You sound like a Democrat talking about the Deep state. I’ve heard it all before mate. 

Come on then, what is it that you've "found", not "what do I sound like" (to you)?

[Mike Oxsaw]

 

Allow me to elaborate:

UK politics is made up of the House of Commons and House of Lords. Bank of England sets monetary policy
autonomously. The Fabian society is not without its influence.


US politics is made up of the House of Representatives and the Senate. The Federal Reserve sets monetary policy autonomously. The Deep state is not without its influence.

Both have 3 branches of Gov’t.

If Donald Trump can come in and secure our borders and send Ice agents out in the streets to round up illegals then so can Farage.

And if you are gonna pipe up about the ECHR, you couldn’t ask for a more aggressive anti European entity than Farage.

There is a video of Farage explaining that the ECHR law that was passed clearly states that the UK maintains its sovereignty and control of its laws in this bill as written.

 

Allow me to correct you.

Whatever flavour of government is in power, it is the state, not the government that actually implements the government's policies - but only if they approve; just look at the effort they put in to getting/trying to get Brexit overturned. They're still smarting like crazy from that one - how very dare the population have a say in how the state runs the country?

If the state (Be it the MoD, MoJ, Home Office, HMRC, etc.) decides to not play along, nothing happens.

 

I disagree, Brexit proves the point. A referendum on the ECHR would be a second example.
Don’t underestimate the power of the people.

 

 

Brexit only got through because the people were pissed off with it dominating the headlines.

Boris Johnson caught that sentiment and got into power on the back of it, but even then the state was using every trick in the book - and then some - to try and thwart him; they came pretty close at times, too.

It wasn't "people power" that got Brexit over the line, it was simply a case of media fatigue - nobody wanted to hear about it 24/7 any more - either way.

I doubt that many those being asked to partake in a referendum for leaving the ECHR have the slightest clue as to what it does, so calling one would only create a tsunami of disinformation from both sides and, most probably a result not too dissimilar to the Brexit result and it's following state encouraged shenanigans.

Politicians are not the answer. Curbing the power of the state is.

[Nutsin]

Here you go Oxsaw, I found it. 

What, exactly, is it you've "found", and how does it relate to my claim that the state holds all the aces when it comes to actually running the country?

You sound like a Democrat talking about the Deep state. I’ve heard it all before mate. 

[Nutsin]

You obviously have little regard for the power of the people. Didn’t have you pegged as a defeatist.

 

Allow me to elaborate:

UK politics is made up of the House of Commons and House of Lords. Bank of England sets monetary policy
autonomously. The Fabian society is not without its influence.


US politics is made up of the House of Representatives and the Senate. The Federal Reserve sets monetary policy autonomously. The Deep state is not without its influence.

Both have 3 branches of Gov’t.

If Donald Trump can come in and secure our borders and send Ice agents out in the streets to round up illegals then so can Farage.

And if you are gonna pipe up about the ECHR, you couldn’t ask for a more aggressive anti European entity than Farage.

There is a video of Farage explaining that the ECHR law that was passed clearly states that the UK maintains its sovereignty and control of its laws in this bill as written.

 

Allow me to correct you.

Whatever flavour of government is in power, it is the state, not the government that actually implements the government's policies - but only if they approve; just look at the effort they put in to getting/trying to get Brexit overturned. They're still smarting like crazy from that one - how very dare the population have a say in how the state runs the country?

If the state (Be it the MoD, MoJ, Home Office, HMRC, etc.) decides to not play along, nothing happens.

 

 

I disagree, Brexit proves the point. A referendum on the ECHR would be a second example.
Don’t underestimate the power of the people.

[Mike Oxsaw]

Here you go Oxsaw, I found it. 

What, exactly, is it you've "found", and how does it relate to my claim that the state holds all the aces when it comes to actually running the country?

[Mike Oxsaw]

 

Then you clearly have no concept of the power and influence the state running the UK  has accumulated over the last 50 years.

You obviously have little regard for the power of the people. Didn’t have you pegged as a defeatist.

 

Allow me to elaborate:

UK politics is made up of the House of Commons and House of Lords. Bank of England sets monetary policy
autonomously. The Fabian society is not without its influence.


US politics is made up of the House of Representatives and the Senate. The Federal Reserve sets monetary policy autonomously. The Deep state is not without its influence.

Both have 3 branches of Gov’t.

If Donald Trump can come in and secure our borders and send Ice agents out in the streets to round up illegals then so can Farage.

And if you are gonna pipe up about the ECHR, you couldn’t ask for a more aggressive anti European entity than Farage.

There is a video of Farage explaining that the ECHR law that was passed clearly states that the UK maintains its sovereignty and control of its laws in this bill as written.

 

 

Allow me to correct you.

Whatever flavour of government is in power, it is the state, not the government that actually implements the government's policies - but only if they approve; just look at the effort they put in to getting/trying to get Brexit overturned. They're still smarting like crazy from that one - how very dare the population have a say in how the state runs the country?

If the state (Be it the MoD, MoJ, Home Office, HMRC, etc.) decides to not play along, nothing happens.

[Nutsin]

Wrong again.

Congrats on not being able to tell the difference between illegal immigrants and British citizens via birth.

bravo.

I think I addressed that about an hour ago. Zzzzzzzzzzz!

[goose]

guess that makes two of us.

Wrong again.

Congrats on not being able to tell the difference between illegal immigrants and British citizens via birth.

bravo.

[Nutsin]

Here you go Oxsaw, I found it. 

[Nutsin]

[only1billybonds]

I skip past the on line love affair between goose and nutsin most days as it is dull, juvenile and ridiculous.
However, the absolute TENACITY on display in  not giving a millimeter is to be admired.
Them guns are being stuck to!

[Nutsin]

Just what I thought you have nothing!

guess that makes two of us.

Wrong again.

[Nutsin]

I can read something which doesn't solve the problem. Nowhere have reform said they will deport british citizens by birth.
You may as well say you're waiting for Mickey Mouse to get elected because its about as relevant.

Just what I thought you have nothing!

guess that makes two of us.

Wrong again.

[Nutsin]

I completely disagree with you!  There will be change. You’ll see!

 

Then you clearly have no concept of the power and influence the state running the UK  has accumulated over the last 50 years.

You obviously have little regard for the power of the people. Didn’t have you pegged as a defeatist.

 

 

Allow me to elaborate:

UK politics is made up of the House of Commons and House of Lords. Bank of England sets monetary policy
autonomously. The Fabian society is not without its influence.


US politics is made up of the House of Representatives and the Senate. The Federal Reserve sets monetary policy autonomously. The Deep state is not without its influence.

Both have 3 branches of Gov’t.

If Donald Trump can come in and secure our borders and send Ice agents out in the streets to round up illegals then so can Farage.

And if you are gonna pipe up about the ECHR, you couldn’t ask for a more aggressive anti European entity than Farage.

There is a video of Farage explaining that the ECHR law that was passed clearly states that the UK maintains its sovereignty and control of its laws in this bill as written.

[goose]

I already told you, can’t you read?

Now what’s your solution?

I can read something which doesn't solve the problem. Nowhere have reform said they will deport british citizens by birth.
You may as well say you're waiting for Mickey Mouse to get elected because its about as relevant.

Just what I thought you have nothing!

guess that makes two of us.

[Nutsin]

"A landslide Reform victory in the next election that’ll go a long way to fixing a lot of it."

Absolute balderdash. The state will never allow Reform to introduce a single one of it's policies.

If you don't understand that simple fact, you don't understand British politics.

I completely disagree with you!  There will be change. You’ll see!

 

Then you clearly have no concept of the power and influence the state running the UK  has accumulated over the last 50 years.

You obviously have little regard for the power of the people. Didn’t have you pegged as a defeatist.

[Nutsin]

so you dont know how to fix it?

I already told you, can’t you read?

Now what’s your solution?

I can read something which doesn't solve the problem. Nowhere have reform said they will deport british citizens by birth.
You may as well say you're waiting for Mickey Mouse to get elected because its about as relevant.

Just what I thought you have nothing!