West Ham Online

"Been through bad time lately with suffering with this. Dark thoughts as well. I know some posters on here suffer with this. Anyone come through the other side of this shit?

"A number of posters have been yellow carded and told to stay off this thread unless they have anything constructive to add.This is a thread that has been very useful to so many, for any other posters with scores to settle, argue on another thread. This thread is sacrosant.Thank you"

"I think sometimes the nature of mental illness means that often the person suffering will have done or will be doing lots of things that are causing it or at least not helping the situation. You have to start by looking at what you can change. I know lots of people who self medicate with alcohol and or drugs and that can make the problems worse. You have to look at every aspect of your life to combat mental illness. Yes meds and therapy can help but as others have said, exercise, nature, volunteering, having a purpose, helping others, mindfulness can all help as well."

"mashed in maryland 3:06 Fri Feb 7 Re: Anxiety/depression I know plenty of people who they work charmingly for. The meds are a tool, they aren’t the solution."

I see. Well I for one have certainly fallen into the Friday curry routine!

"Bungo 5:47 Fri Feb 7 It's a level above that, although that is a focal point in the whole process. Apple, for instance need to shift their latest product, so they use every opportunity to convince people that they are expected to (be one of the first to) own it. Hieneken do a similar thing with their ""beer"", Persil with their washing powder, etc, etc., etc. The board are playing a similar game in trying to paint everything as rosy - making the choice to (pay to) attend games for you. Friday night, many are expected to go down the pub, get rat-arsed then go for a curry. They are also expected to believe that they are really, really having a good time and enjoying it, because, well, everybody else is. We. following West Ham, do it even more so; we support the team, so we religiously turn up at the (new) place of worship every time they do, no matter how bad that can be. we are expected to show our support. To be honest, had work and family commitments not taken precedence in my life all those years ago, I would almost certainly be one of those doing what was ""expected of me"", turning up on demand. Similarly, people, I believe, need to make open & honest value judgements about events in their lives and identify what they are doing because others expect them to do it, an what they are doing because they - alone - made the choice to do so."

Mike Oxsaw 4:48 Fri Feb 7 Do you mean managing patient expectations so not getting a script every visit is more readily accepted?

Timely: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/51312487 IRONS!!!

"So a personal ""drains up"" expectations management could be beneficial? Breaking the link between what others expect of/from you and what you really need could be a first step, even though it means wandering outside one's personal comfort zone in many cases?"

Agreed absolutely bungo

*percent?

Never any danger of a slanging match. I don't do that. The right lifestyle changes across all therapy areas would probably reduce the public reliance on the NHS by 75? The trick would be to inform and get people to make the necessary changes before intervention is sought. Not sure we've cracked that one yet.

"Bung If a ""holistic approach"" is lifestyle changes that improve that list below then they can be very cheap or even free and without nasty side effects, and needn't involve a medical practitioner. This is where I think ""we"" are going wrong. There's a lot of talk about ""mental health"" and encouragement (well meaning I'm sure) to talk to professionals etc but very little if any encouragement to address lifestyle/habits that contribute before it gets to that. And the less said about SSRIs the better. I don't think we're gonna fully agree on this, and you're entitled to your opinion and I don't want this to turn into another slanging match so I'll respectfully finish there"

"Westham67 3:57 Fri Feb 7 It's a big problem. Mental health by it's nature can suck up huge levels of resource as there are no quick fixes and talking therapies are very people/time intensive and hence expensive. I have known many GPs who hate having to send someone back out with a script after a 7 minute consultation, but usually haven't got much else they can offer in the short term."

"Westham67 3:57 Fri Feb 7 It's a big problem. Mental health by it's nature can suck up huge levels of resource as there are no quick fixes and talking therapies are very people/time intensive and hence expensive. I have known many GPs who hate having to send someone back out with a script after a 7 minute consultation, but usually haven't got much else they can offer in the short term."

"Doug, if you're reading this and I know you come here... come home fella. Yes it's a fucking shitstorm but we've got your back. All of those things on your mind are of no concern to us. We just want you and your love. This is a new beginning for all of us. Please just call us buddy. We know everything and we're not angry. xx"

Yeah that's it Bungo. I just wanted to talk to Psychiatrist but there wasn't enough time and he prescribed me meds which I told I did not want due getting conflicting meds from 4 different departments for over a year

Not necessarily. If someone can get over their difficulties by other means then this is almost certainly a good thing. 'Medical' does not necessarily mean pharmaceutical or even surgical. It can mean anything that helps the person/patient. Think of medical practitioners as people trained to help other people by a whole variety of means (which may or may not include drugs). A buzz term I hear a lot in Medicine currently is 'holistic approach'. Most practitioners in healthcare wish they had the time and resources to spend more of their time pursuing this.

"Think this is where we disagree. You think there should or must be a medical answer, and I don't (unless as an absolute last resort). Correct me if I'm wrong?"

"Think this is where we disagree. You think there should or must be a medical answer, and I don't (unless as an absolute last resort). Correct me if I'm wrong?"

"Well the best we have currently is the medical profession. When I wrote: ""Every patient is different. Each needs to be assessed, diagnosed and prescribed relevant treatments individually. No one size should fit all"", the word 'treatments' covers everything. not just pills and potions. You would probably be surprised how anti-pharmaceuticals many Drs are. They are forced into trying these first as the rest of their options are so limited. Frankly, there have never been safer anti-depressants available, so the risk with current treatments is a lot less than older ones (tricyclics for example). I wouldn't have those in the house if I had a young child they are so dangerous in overdose."

"I don't have ""the answer"", Bungo. I'm just saying the current accepted trend of treating anxiety/depression as ""mental illness"" that needs ""treatment"" by a doctor/meds (meds which are addictive and exacerbate both causes and symptoms) doesn't make sense and clearly isn't working."

"So if they're not seeking medical help, who should be doing what exactly?"

They're encouraged to. And as you say many won't leave without a script. You seem to be under the impression I'm blaming doctors here; I'm not.

"If they're not presenting as a patient, then they won't be one."

"Bungo Before it even gets to the stage of being a patient, people should be encouraged to look at: - their diet - their booze/drug consumption - their activity levels and general fitness - their sleep patterns - their stress levels - their surroundings - their relationship/sex life - the general ""mood"" of the people around them - what they spend most of their time doing - stuff in their past that might be affecting them If someone's lacking in a few of the above a pill isn't going to help long term and I'm not even sure it should be treated as a medical problem, definutely not as a first resort anyway. And the thing is that SSRI side effects often negatively affect many of the above. See where I'm going with this?"

"Every patient is different. Each needs to be assessed, diagnosed and prescribed relevant treatments individually. No one size should fit all."