West Ham Online

This lad is a real problem.

At £40mil, it's getting to the point of worst ever signing territory. The worst crime in football is hiding, centre back is probably the one position you can half get away with it, but not for too long. Shirks taking responsibility, who imo makes him worse than Mavropanos, at least he fronts up, which can lead to mistakes. Kilman doesn't, so it doesn't get highlighted.

We've obviously got a massive overhaul in the summer, but for me, he is the biggest problem in our team and we need to cut our losses if we can. It took a while to spot, because he hides, but you can't fool people for too long. Wolves fans told us, some wouldn't have it, but they were dead right. Absolute fraud of a player.

easthammer wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 16:58  He needs a partner to complement the way he plays.

 

Interesting stuff, however, you can never beat the eye test with stats.

For example, I bet there isn't a stat for when playing left of a back 3, you leave an inexperienced 19 year old all on his own up against the best player in the Premier League, time after time.

Opta won't be measuring that, I do though. I'm not bothered about how many clearances he makes, or 'progressive carries'.

https://fbref.com/en/players/d0f72bf1/s ... ing-Report

First, I think Kilman was overpriced at £40m, but I assume that was Lopetegui's fault. However, as others have said I don't think there is much or any chance of moving him on any time soon. If you look at his opta stats ( current and in the past) it becomes obvious that the one thing he doesn't do is tackle and this is where I think our current problems lie. Some of you will be shouting at this fact. What is the point of a centre back who can't or doesn't tackle? I would have some empathy with such a view. But obviously not Lopetegui and those who wanted to play a more possession-based style than experienced under Moyes.

Kilman has some good qualities compared to other Centre Backs in the Premeirship his stats for interceptions, blocks, clearances and aerials won are well above the average. He is also above average for successful take-ons and progressive carries. He has average pass completion rates, he has been ever present and has only been booked four times ( maybe because he doesn't tackle!) 

When at the end of ( or anytime in ) the game, when teams are putting us under the cosh because they have walked through our meek tackling, slow-moving midfield, just don't be looking for Kilman to be flying in with a match-saving tackle, it just ain't his style and never has been. Kilman's overall figures are down on his  Wolves outings, but not the general pattern of what he does and does not bring to the team. He needs a partner to complement the way he plays. Interestingly, Mavaropanos' figures of strengths and weaknesses are very similar to Kilmans. ( The stats don't feature on crucial  cock ups though). Todibo has a greater propensity to tackle - but for that to happen you have to be fit and on the pitch to do it.

 

He makes our starting 11 if we're using 3CBs, because we only have 3 senior CB's on our books.

He's a 20m defender at best.  Not a 40m one.

Good work lopetegi.  

We've weighed out £40mil on a centre back that can't play in a back four.

Heady days.

He still makes our starting 11 if we're using 3CBs with wing backs. Again, and I keep using this phrase, it says more about West ham than it does him.

Beast of a CB not “beat” although could be a right if it read “dead beat” I suppose

We are stuck with him unfortunately. Could be devent back up to Todibo and hopefully another beat of a CB we bring in over the summer. Expensive squad player for sure but thats where we are so may as well try to use as best we can as backuo and in some cup games etc

Of course, wishful thinking we get another CB in but if we can sell Aguerd and / or Mavro possibly? That said, the CB sits behind central midgield and striking dept in the priorities

scott_d wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 12:40 The common theme for most of these players that are shit is the club they play for.

When Kilman first played, there was even some comments about him a steal at £40m.  He looked solid and played out from the back, just need a little time to settle.

Since he has settled into this circus of a club, he's gone backwards.

There is a player in there, as there is in most of our squad.  But there is something rotten at West Ham right now. 

Can't really blame DS directly, but his job is to employ the right people to run the club and employ the right people to do that.  With the manager, coaching staff and players, he's getting something very wrong.  I don't think it's a simple case of the player is shit, or the manager is shit, or the coaching staff are shit, but something clearly is wrong.

scott_d wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 12:41

scott_d wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 12:40 "When Kilman first played, there was even some comments about him a steal at £40m.  He looked solid and played out from the back, just need a little time to settle."

 

Maybe a bit dramatic, but certainly some said he was a good signing.

scott_d wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 12:40 "When Kilman first played, there was even some comments about him a steal at £40m.  He looked solid and played out from the back, just need a little time to settle."
 

The common theme for most of these players that are shit is the club they play for.

When Kilman first played, there was even some comments about him a steal at £40m.  He looked solid and played out from the back, just need a little time to settle.

Since he has settled into this circus of a club, he's gone backwards.

There is a player in there, as there is in most of our squad.  But there is something rotten at West Ham right now. 

Can't really blame DS directly, but his job is to employ the right people to run the club and employ the right people to do that.  With the manager, coaching staff and players, he's getting something very wrong.  I don't think it's a simple case of the player is shit, or the manager is shit, or the coaching staff are shit, but something clearly is wrong.

His transfer price isn't the issue with him now.  As a club you'd take the hit on him just to get him out to improve the defence.

But who is mental enough to pick up his 6 year contract on £100k a week?

I reckon we're stuck with him for at least another season, possibly much longer.

Kilman was worth half what we paid for him and based on this season that looks like an overspend too.

But he is just one variable in a set that has led us to the deep rut we now sit in.  The squad depth, weakness and imbalance another huge reason, the lack of a long term plan and DOF to execute it at the root of all problems and hence our owner.  Btw, Sullivan wants success, has made budget available but his meddling, need for recognition, control whatever, means he consistently "shoots himself in the feet".  Hard to tell anyone they are the biggest part of the problem and barrier to success especially a small narcissist.

We need another CB, one who is quick, physical beast but also very athletic who has good passing and control. Van Dyke a few years back is the template or someone like Rudegar but to buy the finished article is well beyond our budget.  All comes back to recruitment and getting a young, perhaps raw version and developing them.  Trouble is every club has data analytics and every part of the world is scouted.  We are catching up in this area. One of the last to take this approach but arguably not implemented properly because almost every other club in top flight football has the analytics as part of a football strategy overseen and directed by a DOF.   Even if we identify them, we then have our owner entrusted to agree with the choice and then negotiate and get a deal over the line.  Odds are against us

 

It was obvious early doors that he wasn't up to it.  The amount of excuses I've seen for him for him to be able to perform has been ridiculous.  That he needs better defenders around him.  That he needs better midfielders in front of him.  That he needs to be played in a back 3.  That he needs to play in the centre of a back 3.  Maybe he's just shit?

I'd take whatever hit on him and look to move him on, otherwise our defence won't improve.

Sir Alf" wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 09:27 Without a rickett I should have said

Without a rickett I should have said

Mavropanos is currently defying the odds. Its been a long run of what, 5 or 6 games ( maybe more ) of a memorable rickett?  

Massive Attack" wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 09:07

Gank wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 09:04 Mavropanos always seems to play well for Greece.

So did Gary Breen for Ireland. It's not always a good measure to gauge from with the generally slower tempo of International Football compared to the intensity of most games in the Prem. 

Gank wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025, 09:04 Mavropanos always seems to play well for Greece.

Mavropanos always seems to play well for Greece.

He's been very poor this season, no doubt about that.

Massive Attack" wrote: ↑27 Apr 2025, 22:24 Mavropanos blows both Todibo and Kilman out the water when it comes to who's been the most disastrous defender currently at the Club. A constant accident waiting to happen. Get rid ASAP.

Mavropanos blows both Todibo and Kilman out the water when it comes to who's been the most disastrous defender currently at the Club. A constant accident waiting to happen. Get rid ASAP.