Fights that would have had a different outcome if both fighters were in their prime.
I’ll go Hagler v Leonard and Tyson v Hollyfield.
Who you got?
Re: Boxing
Posted: 15 Nov 2025, 00:32
by Massive Attack
And yet someone like Usyk continues to go undefeated having also fought and won at different weight classes against some of the heaviest hitters around at a similar age to Roy Jones Junior losing to Calzaghe and on record as saying he's happy to continue on for another 3 years till he's 41. No one is denying Jones Junior wasn't quality, just that he wasn't as good as Calzaghe.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 15 Nov 2025, 00:24
by Eerie Decent
You've once again mentioned a fight when RJJ was touching 40 and had long done the ridiculous weight changes ffs
If you don't recognise RJJ as one of the top 10 boxers across all weights of all time, it's not worth taking the debate any further. He was utterly ridiculous in his prime, pure talent wise, possibly in the top 3 that have ever lived.
He would'vwould'vethe floor with Calzaghe in his prime.
Danny knocked Tyson out in 4 rounds. That's convincing. By your logic.
Yes because he never lost as well did he...
I think you're really struggling with the concept of 'prime'
Hopkins is widely considered one of if not the best MW of all time, and he fought both men. If he says no one would touch RJJ in his prime, I reckon it's worth listening to.
Calzaghe's best wins against fighters in their prime was Lacy & Kessler. RJJ was Hopkins, Toney & McCallum. Up until he went up too many weights, he was unbeatable. Incredible boxer, but you've set your stall out on a Brit so no point debating it anymore really.
I understand it fine and never said either were in their prime when they fought. The problem is we'll never find out so no one would know for sure and can only speculate. The fact Calzaghe beat everyone he ever faced undefeated throughout his career including Roy Jones Junior convincingly in America with both coming to the end of their careers is strong evidence that even in their prime I still think Calzaghe beats him. So it's not like we can't say they never faced one another when they did at MSG. Got no issue with anyone saying otherwise, but no one will ever know for certain.
zebthecat wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025, 08:48
Lloyd Honeyghan's dismantling of Don Curry has to be one of the biggest upsets of all time.
Kirkland Laing beating Roberto Duran in Detroit must push that close
Curry was the P4P and everyone thought the next GOAT, Invincible to anyone, Honeyghan wasn't even considered the best contender.
Duran was 31 and coming off a loss and didn't bother to train for Laing. Whilst it was an upset, it wasn't close to what Honeyghan achieved.
Lloyd Honeyghan was hardly a journeyman bum, he went into that fight he was unbeaten at 27-0, very aggressive and hungry, and the legitimate no1 welterweight contender against what would turn out to be an over confident champion. Who had issues with his management team never trained properly and subsequently struggled to make the weight, Curry lost 10-pounds in the days leading up to the fight.
Curry never fought at welterweight again so perhaps it was one fight too many at the weight. Give that one could surmise that it hardly an upset at all.
Public perception makes it upset but analysis and context made it a much more predictable outcome
It doesn’t matter how talented you are, if you don’t take it seriously, for whatever reason, are over-confident and drained through weight loss you’re gonna get bashed in by the No1 contender
Both Britons beat legendary, but undercooked fighters
That said both fights were named as Ring Magazine “Upset of the Year”
Danny knocked Tyson out in 4 rounds. That's convincing. By your logic.
Yes because he never lost as well did he...
I think you're really struggling with the concept of 'prime'
Hopkins is widely considered one of if not the best MW of all time, and he fought both men. If he says no one would touch RJJ in his prime, I reckon it's worth listening to.
Calzaghe's best wins against fighters in their prime was Lacy & Kessler. RJJ was Hopkins, Toney & McCallum. Up until he went up too many weights, he was unbeatable. Incredible boxer, but you've set your stall out on a Brit so no point debating it anymore really.
He's also a complete fucking idiot when it comes to boxing as well.
Massive Attack" wrote: ↑14 Nov 2025, 10:51
Nah, just the fact he clearly beat him convincingly in America as well as never, ever losing a fight.
Danny knocked Tyson out in 4 rounds. That's convincing. By your logic.
Yes because he never lost as well did he...
I think you're really struggling with the concept of 'prime'
Hopkins is widely considered one of if not the best MW of all time, and he fought both men. If he says no one would touch RJJ in his prime, I reckon it's worth listening to.
Calzaghe's best wins against fighters in their prime was Lacy & Kessler. RJJ was Hopkins, Toney & McCallum. Up until he went up too many weights, he was unbeatable. Incredible boxer, but you've set your stall out on a Brit so no point debating it anymore really.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 14 Nov 2025, 14:00
by Mr Anon
sort of understand the hate he gets but Eubank was one of the best things to happen to British boxing imo, a world class entertainer
zebthecat wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025, 08:48
Lloyd Honeyghan's dismantling of Don Curry has to be one of the biggest upsets of all time.
Kirkland Laing beating Roberto Duran in Detroit must push that close
Curry was the P4P and everyone thought the next GOAT, Invincible to anyone, Honeyghan wasn't even considered the best contender.
Duran was 31 and coming off a loss and didn't bother to train for Laing. Whilst it was an upset, it wasn't close to what Honeyghan achieved.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 14 Nov 2025, 09:39
by Council Scum
Eerie Decent" wrote: ↑13 Nov 2025, 17:03
Bernard Hopkins has recently said that at his peak, no one in history would've beat Roy Jones Jnr.
Some compliment from an all time great, that.
He's a step down from Calzaghe, Massive Attack will happily tell you.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 17:03
by Eerie Decent
Bernard Hopkins has recently said that at his peak, no one in history would've beat Roy Jones Jnr.
Some compliment from an all time great, that.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 16:33
by oh dear II
zebthecat wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025, 08:48
Lloyd Honeyghan's dismantling of Don Curry has to be one of the biggest upsets of all time.
Kirkland Laing beating Roberto Duran in Detroit must push that close
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 15:49
by F 129 Row66
Anyone on here like "lady's" boxing? Personally I don't think women should be allowed to do any sport involving fighting, Apart from, of course, wrestling in mud.
BerlingtonBertie wrote: ↑13 Nov 2025, 05:12
Eubank Snr has always been and always will be a cսnt in my book. Granted a hard tough cսnt, but had the worst and least valued belt at the time, WBO and never left the UK to fight abroad from my recollection.
Benn fought anyone, anywhere in their backyard. Was superb in the States when he done DeWitt.
Dewitt wasn't much of a fighter though. Hopkins, Nunn, McCallum, Toney, Jones Jnr, all were the best about back then, Benn fought none of them.
Was intrigued about this so been doing some googling. Not sure if true but apparently -
"Benn's fight with McClellan wasn't initially on the cards. The promoter first offered Michael Nunn as an opponent but wanted Benn to take a $100,000 pay cut. When Benn refused, he got an ultimatum: fight Nunn or face a "mini-Mike Tyson" in McClellan."
"Just before the Eubank-Benn rematch in 1993. Toney held the IBF super middleweight title, which he'd defended twice in the U.S. before facing Roy Jones Jr. in 1994. Obviously he lost that fight, and afterwards he moved up to light heavyweight (and beyond).
Both Eubank and Benn stayed at super middleweight after their second fight so having a weight disparity plus the barrier of finding a compelling reason to cross the Atlantic for a fight seemingly prevented them from ever fighting Toney."
Couldn't find too much re Benn vJones Jnr
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 11:58
by Lee Trundle
Looks like the cringefest of AJ v Jake Paul might actually happen in December.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 11:09
by Council Scum
BerlingtonBertie wrote: ↑13 Nov 2025, 05:12
Eubank Snr has always been and always will be a cսnt in my book. Granted a hard tough cսnt, but had the worst and least valued belt at the time, WBO and never left the UK to fight abroad from my recollection.
Benn fought anyone, anywhere in their backyard. Was superb in the States when he done DeWitt.
Dewitt wasn't much of a fighter though. Hopkins, Nunn, McCallum, Toney, Jones Jnr, all were the best about back then, Benn fought none of them.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 11:04
by Council Scum
Nutsin wrote: ↑12 Nov 2025, 15:32
I never met him but I never liked Eubank.
Gary stretch is a bit of a cսnt, his brother Roni is a likable character though.
I like Benn the person and the fighter, same with Lennox Lewis.
Gary Stretch got a slap off the long fella in a boozer back in the day.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 06:57
by Takashi Miike
bertie, his first few pro fights (four rounders) were in america but I agree, he never went over at his peak and took on the best
Re: Boxing
Posted: 13 Nov 2025, 05:12
by BerlingtonBertie
Eubank Snr has always been and always will be a cսnt in my book. Granted a hard tough cսnt, but had the worst and least valued belt at the time, WBO and never left the UK to fight abroad from my recollection.
Benn fought anyone, anywhere in their backyard. Was superb in the States when he done DeWitt.
Re: Boxing
Posted: 12 Nov 2025, 15:41
by Far Cough UKunt
What the fuck was Eubank on about in that clip? Sounded like a lot of mumbo jumbo.