The Next West Ham Manager.

[THUNDERCLINT]

Well, El Flop needs fucking off tonight.

Sergio Conceicao isn't working, worth a go?

[Massive Attack]

Thing is, it's not even about my faith in Lopetegui. I've never really liked Moyes managerial style, but even with him I gave him plenty of time and space to succeed/fail and never called for his head until around the time we were suffering badly for form/performances around the time I called for us to go after Emery, only to watch him go to Villa once they sacked Gerrard. That was my personal sliding doors moment but it took 2 spells and quite a while in to his 2nd stint before I said I want a change for someone like Emery.

[onsideman]

You'd be forgiven for thinking our new manager has had a horrendous run of results for quite some time to get to the point people are baying for his blood, when in reality, it's not been quite as horrific as some make out.

I'll caveat it by saying I agree that performances overall haven't been good enough and ideally we'd be at least 2 wins better off but other than that, I feel the expectations are way too high if what's happened so far is a sackable offence being 5 minutes in the job, especially since he's only been in charge of 13 games.

So, the breakdown of games:

VILLA (H) - 1-2 - L
PALACE (A) - 0-2 - W 
BOURNEMOUTH (H) - 1-0 - W 
MAN CITY (H) - 1-3 - L
FULHAM (A) - 1-1 - D
CHELSEA (H) - 0-3 - L
LIVERPOOL (A) - 5-1 - L
BRENTFORD (A) - 1-1 - D
IPSWICH (H) - 4-1 - W
-----------------------------------------
SPURS (A) - 4-1 - L
MAN UTD (H) - 2-1 - W
FOREST (A) - 3-0 - L
EVERTON (H) - 0-0 - D 

4 wins
6 losses
3 draws
3 clean sheets

Chronologically down to the line after 9 games where results have been fairly understandable. Then we have the remaining 4 recent matches that have produced patchy results but again overall nothing wild that screams sack the useless know nothing bastard.

Further context, altogether in those 13 games there are 5 losses against Teams that finished last season in the Top 6. 

3 spankings when we had 3 separate sending offs in the game due to ill discipline. 

Unusually we've had 3 International breaks dur8jg the quarter of a season already where a few key player's have gone on International duty for 2 weeks at a time.

Also a key long term injury to new main Striker Fullkrug that's been out of Lopetegui's hands.

My argument isn't to say that what we've done till now after 13 games is good, it's anything but, as the quality of Football generally hasn't been good enough. And if Lopetegui had been here for over a season producing what we have seen, then ok it's understandable. However nor do I see that huge body of work from a brand new manager fair to judge him on, to the point people are baying for his blood and instantly want him sacked. Actually those calls started a while ago which leads me to be suspicious of some wanting him to fail and fuck off before he's really began...

I thought we used to pride ourselves as a Club/Fanbase on giving new manager's ample time to prove themselves first, not after just 13 matches (or less!) begging for a new manager already. Modern Football, I fucking despise it.


 

Thing is, those of us who would be happy to see the back of him just can't see that with the pitiful recruitment and simply bizarre selections coupled with the apparent lack of team morale,  any improvement is likely. You think he's a good manager so have more faith in that being the case 

[Massive Attack]

You'd be forgiven for thinking our new manager has had a horrendous run of results for quite some time to get to the point people are baying for his blood, when in reality, it's not been quite as horrific as some make out.

I'll caveat it by saying I agree that performances overall haven't been good enough and ideally we'd be at least 2 wins better off but other than that, I feel the expectations are way too high if what's happened so far is a sackable offence being 5 minutes in the job, especially since he's only been in charge of 13 games.

So, the breakdown of games:

VILLA (H) - 1-2 - L
PALACE (A) - 0-2 - W 
BOURNEMOUTH (H) - 1-0 - W 
MAN CITY (H) - 1-3 - L
FULHAM (A) - 1-1 - D
CHELSEA (H) - 0-3 - L
LIVERPOOL (A) - 5-1 - L
BRENTFORD (A) - 1-1 - D
IPSWICH (H) - 4-1 - W
-----------------------------------------
SPURS (A) - 4-1 - L
MAN UTD (H) - 2-1 - W
FOREST (A) - 3-0 - L
EVERTON (H) - 0-0 - D 

4 wins
6 losses
3 draws
3 clean sheets

Chronologically down to the line after 9 games where results have been fairly understandable. Then we have the remaining 4 recent matches that have produced patchy results but again overall nothing wild that screams sack the useless know nothing bastard.

Further context, altogether in those 13 games there are 5 losses against Teams that finished last season in the Top 6 (And the Top 3 of this season). 

3 spankings when we had 3 separate sending offs in the game due to ill discipline. 

Unusually we've had 3 International breaks dur8jg the quarter of a season already where a few key player's have gone on International duty for 2 weeks at a time.

Also a key long term injury to new main Striker Fullkrug that's been out of Lopetegui's hands.

My argument isn't to say that what we've done till now after 13 games is good, it's anything but, as the quality of Football generally hasn't been good enough. And if Lopetegui had been here for over a season producing what we have seen, then ok it's understandable. However nor do I see that huge body of work from a brand new manager fair to judge him on, to the point people are baying for his blood and instantly want him sacked. Actually those calls started a while ago which leads me to be suspicious of some wanting him to fail and fuck off before he's really began...

I thought we used to pride ourselves as a Club/Fanbase on giving new manager's ample time to prove themselves first, not after just 13 matches (or less!) begging for a new manager already. Modern Football, I fucking despise it.

 

[nychammer]

I don’t see him going anywhere until January. We’ve got a decent run of games in December and they’ll be hoping he’ll be able to rack up some points with kudus bsck.
Im unsure whether he is a shit tactician or just made bad calls on the summer signings. Rodriguez, fulkrug and soler don’t look well suited to this league and were key positions that needed filling. We need pace in midfield and upfront and we simply don’t have it. I’m not sure any manager could make this squad work in the premier league. 

Mistakes we make time after time:  Signing ill suited players who cant adapt here, perma crocks who barely play a game or just failing to fill open positions at all. Other teams have made this mistake but we've turned it into an art form. I thought having Steidten here would have reduced the signimgs-to-duds  ratio but looks like we've signed a hatful again. 

[Sir Alf]

Similar thinking to you Django except that another coach / manager that was prepared to compromise or change their tactical approach would imo likely get better results.  

The summer recruitment was in hindsight “half cocked”. On paper and pethaps even data backs up that most signings were good value. In the case of Kilman we overpaid but he is a good  premiership player as is Todibo, Wan Bissaka and Summerville. The problem we had, goes back to Moyes allowing the squad to deplete and age too much. It meant we really had to get all outfield player signings right in terms of their profile and fit. After 13-14 games ( all comps ) we can see that we didn’t.

lopetegui is in a tough place though. He sells himself to Sullivan ( or unconscious bias for Sully as he fits his free, agent provided option who has the “bling factor” of managing Spain and Real Madrid on his CV)  and explains how he will make West Ham “a big noise” playing with the ball ( “West Ham way”) and leave Moyesball borefest ( albeit some early success in first 2 of 4 seasons results wise undoubtedly, in the past ).   

He’s cornered is Loppy. If he was smart and went into proper self preservation mode he would abandon his tactics and principles to play a more pragmatic ( yep even Moyesesque) style for a while and sit us deeper back in a mid or low block and once again rely on counters and set pieces.  But if he’s never coached that way he wont know how to. Just like Moyes didnt know how or have experience of playing a more expansive, modern game with beyter technical players. 

Hence we are in the same place league wise and perhaps slightly worse. Moyes and Loppy at each end of the scale but unable to adapt. 

Short term ( this season ) we have to go back to a more “agricultural” style or risk relegation level struggles. The fix will only come with replacing Rodruiguez, Soucek, Paqueta, Soler as starters in midfield most weeks and getting a proper fast, strong outlet to replace Antonio.  Im not sure Loppys tactics of a slower build up and passing thru teams is honna work even then but it will have a much better chance when we have the players to actually run and press effectively and to resist the counter attacks that run thru our leaden footed midfield.

But I suspect the outcome is known. Loppy will continue with his way, more thrashings and defeats and gone in Jan. Another “what might have been”.

The most important question though by far is whether anyone knows, can see or acknowledges what the majority of fans and even a lot of media pundits see? Central midfield and central forward area personnel aint suited to the tactics!!!!
 

[Django]

I don’t see him going anywhere until January. We’ve got a decent run of games in December and they’ll be hoping he’ll be able to rack up some points with kudus bsck.
Im unsure whether he is a shit tactician or just made bad calls on the summer signings. Rodriguez, fulkrug and soler don’t look well suited to this league and were key positions that needed filling. We need pace in midfield and upfront and we simply don’t have it. I’m not sure any manager could make this squad work in the premier league. 

[simons]

The little cսnt never does anything logically. If he did, we wouldn’t have entertained Loppy in the first place, so although the break was the ideal time to move him on, Sullivan was always going to sit on his hands. Newcastle has become a pretty big game now though, as a good hiding up there will surely see him gone, rather than wait for the same outcome against Arsenal and a toxic LS.

[Fauxstralian]

At one time you could think the manager could get binned in the 16 day break between the Everton & Newcastle games but with Newcastle away & then Arsenal up next am not sure that was ever an option.
A couple more heavy defeats & the axe could fall with Wolves at home after that for the new manager.

[nychammer]

He's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.  He clearly has been given a remit to evolve our style of football, after all if he kept the Moyes system in place we'd all be asking what was the point?  But to get to where we want to be is going to take time. I said this would potentially be a season of comparative struggle but I didn't think we'd be as bad as we have been and he seems to be struggling to find a starting 11 that really clicks. 

He wasn't my first choice and wouldn't have even been on my short list, however the dwarf being the dwarf etc.....He'll get til January and if we're not in trouble he won't be going anywhere, so may as well get used to it now.
 

[Massive Attack]

It's going to be amusing should Lopetegui turn this early season poor form around, as so many can't stand him and want him gone yesterday from the fans, the media, the job lot.

Loppy  should count himself lucky our fan base are such pussies now .

Once upon a time we used to pride ourselves on giving new manager's a proper chance. Just 13 games in and the landscape has completely changed and not for the better. 

That's not to say he probably still isn't right for us, just that quarter of a season is nothing to seriously judge a new manager by. 

[Monsieur merde de cheval]

It's going to be amusing should Lopetegui turn this early season poor form around, as so many can't stand him and want him gone yesterday from the fans, the media, the job lot.

Loppy  should count himself lucky our fan base are such pussies now .

[Monsieur merde de cheval]

The unemployed  alternatives look rather grim.
It's too late now anyhow 
If the club (smurf) meant business this geezer would have been gone last week.

The club really do not deserve our loyal support.

 

[Massive Attack]

It's going to be amusing should Lopetegui turn this early season poor form around, as so many can't stand him and want him gone yesterday from the fans, the media, the job lot.

[LeroysBoots]

That's why I'm bewildered why they are keeping Lopetegui on, he literally has not shown any way of getting out of this mess

[Manuel]

I don’t see Max Allegri coming here, and I’m not sure it’s a great fit either.

Similarly I’m not sure Terzic is the right guy either. Did he fall out with Fullkrug?

anyway, Lopetegui is here for a while yet.

You genuinely believe that? We wont beat Barcodes Monday and so if results go against us at weekend, we could be 17th at 10pm on Monday night. Lose to the Arse week after we and could be going to Leicester and then at home to Wolves with those games being viewed as genuine relegation scraps. You think Lope will still be around for those matches? I don't. 

I agree and said similar. But what could keep him here is if he wings it by winning the must win games like when we play Wolves for example. The problem with that is you are writing off a season, and after spending 150 million and having 60,000 fans in every week that would be pure negligence on Sullivan's part and I don't see how he would get away with it with so long off the season left still, or are we that gutless now as a fan base?

That said, unlike Moyes, and to an extent BFS, I don't see this hapless cսnt winning his must wins.

[goose]

I don’t see Max Allegri coming here, and I’m not sure it’s a great fit either.

Similarly I’m not sure Terzic is the right guy either. Did he fall out with Fullkrug?

anyway, Lopetegui is here for a while yet.

You genuinely believe that? We wont beat Barcodes Monday and so if results go against us at weekend, we could be 17th at 10pm on Monday night. Lose to the Arse week after we and could be going to Leicester and then at home to Wolves with those games being viewed as genuine relegation scraps. You think Lope will still be around for those matches? I don't. 

Yes I genuinely believe that, based upon previous actions by Sullivan. I think he'll look at Leicester & Wolves as 'games to save his job'.

I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but it is how Sullivan operates historically.

[Pub Bigot]

Been catching up on webcasts etc from the last week. One outrageous one claimed Allegri would be interested in the job?  No way. Too successful, tajes no nonsense from players, owners etc 

But more than all of the above he isnt a Will Salthouse or Mackay client.

Sullivan is and has, for 13-14 years, been the root cause of all our problems. 30 years behind the times and has to have control to conpromise for a life time of feeling small and lonely “on the inside”. ( like that caricature of Kim Jong Un in the film “Team America” ) .

If he cared about anyone other than himself he would put hundreds of thousands of fans first by binning his choice, admitting he was wrong ( yeah I know ) , paying Loppy off ( yeah I know again ) and thinking about the long term interest of the club not trying to send some virtuous signal about not sacking managers ( which is his excuse for avoiding the 2 “yeah I knows” above).

We cant do much and a rant on a web site aint gonna change anything but it just beggars belief how he gets away with it.  Selfish to the very core of his DNA is Sullivan.

Ahh, that feels better.

*** Alf resecures straps on straight jacket *** 

All of that is true, but the reason he cannot admit he's wrong and put the club first is because it's never been about the club being successful, it's always been about the bowl we play in and taking it over when the LLDC/Government want rid as they've been taken for mugs with the current arrangement. I also imagine that's why nobody has tried to take a controlling share in the club.

God, I hope the little cսnt dies soon. 

[Russ of the BML]

I don’t see Max Allegri coming here, and I’m not sure it’s a great fit either.

Similarly I’m not sure Terzic is the right guy either. Did he fall out with Fullkrug?

anyway, Lopetegui is here for a while yet.

You genuinely believe that? We wont beat Barcodes Monday and so if results go against us at weekend, we could be 17th at 10pm on Monday night. Lose to the Arse week after we and could be going to Leicester and then at home to Wolves with those games being viewed as genuine relegation scraps. You think Lope will still be around for those matches? I don't. 

[Massive Attack]

What are you on about? Of course if the piss poor form continues he'll be gone and rightly so. I was just making the point the toad would bend his own rules to suit who he'd rather keep on. 

On the flip of that though, should the form start to improve Lopetegui should keep his job. 

[Manuel]

Moyes was kept on because he was a Sullivan favourite yes-man and always refused to get rid of him even though there was ample opportunities to do so. Plus he's a tight-fisted cսnt.

He'd bend his own rules of giving a manager as much time as possible when it suited and ditched both Bilic and Pellegrini far too soon time wise by comparison, as well as mitigating circumstances like a brand new controversial hellish Stadium move/long-term injury to a key member of the Team I.e. Fabianski. 

Moyes though.. well he got all the time in the world till his contract ran out in the end and even got given a 2nd contract based on very little reason. 

Yea, yea, yawn, another fucking know it all. Regardless of what some of you experts think if this shitness continues then Lop is gone, his position will become untenable.

[Massive Attack]

Moyes was kept on because he was a Sullivan favourite yes-man and always refused to get rid of him even though there was ample opportunities to do so. Plus he's a tight-fisted cսnt.

He'd bend his own rules of giving a manager as much time as possible when it suited and ditched both Bilic and Pellegrini far too soon time wise by comparison, by not factoring in mitigating circumstances like a brand new controversial hellish Stadium move/long-term injury to a key member of the Team I.e. Fabianski. 

Moyes though.. well he got all the time in the world till his contract ran out in the end and even got given a 2nd contract based on very little reason. 

[Manuel]

There is some wishful thinking going on here. Sullivan will not ditch jalopy unless he thinks that the risk of relegation is greater keeping him compared to getting someone new in.

It’s where we are in the table that will determine our manager’s fate and right now there is clear blue water between us and the bottom three.

That said though if we finish in fourteenth place averaging a little more than a point a game I am sure Jalopy will be ditched.

Oh yea, what makes you the expert then?? I keep hearing this view, but there is little to back it up, weren't Bilic and Pellegrini both sacked around December? I am not convinced even if we stay out of the bottom 3 we will just write of the whole season off after spending 150 mil, which we will be if we keep Lop. If we continue on this current hapless form then he's gone.

The only reason Moyes was kept on was because he kept winning must win games and we were in Europe, this fella has nothing to cling to.

[,]

There is some wishful thinking going on here. Sullivan will not ditch jalopy unless he thinks that the risk of relegation is greater keeping him compared to getting someone new in.

It’s where we are in the table that will determine our manager’s fate and right now there is clear blue water between us and the bottom three.

That said though if we finish in fourteenth place averaging a little more than a point a game I am sure Jalopy will be ditched.

[Manuel]

anyway, Lopetegui is here for a while yet.

If we lose to Toon and Arse and we are all at sea still then I think he's gone.

[goose]

I don’t see Max Allegri coming here, and I’m not sure it’s a great fit either.

Similarly I’m not sure Terzic is the right guy either. Did he fall out with Fullkrug?

anyway, Lopetegui is here for a while yet.