The Official Politics Thread (enter at your own risk)

[Come On You Irons]

There. Resident WHO political commentators and gurus can knock yourselves out in here and conduct your endless bickering. All other threads will be locked.

[ironsofcanada]

All the US/Ukraine/Russia/EU stuff is a proper circus at the moment.

You've got Zelensky saying Trump is "living in a disinformation space" but also trying to keep the US onside because he needs their support. Apparently the US wants 50% of the rare earth minerals from Ukraine.

Meanwhile the European leaders are desperately trying to make themselves look relevant by having their own meetings which nobody cares about.

It's a really tough one for me. (Personally, the Ukrainian community around where I grew up is super strong.  And my nephew's wife is Ukrainian, she came from school before all this started but had years where she could not see her parents etc.)

Ukraine obviously has the right to self-determination and is it too Darwinian to say if it can't survive on its own, it shouldn't survive? Probably.

But there is a reason the Ukraine wasn't a part of NATO and other alliances befor this and a lot of it is because it was mess politically.  And a lot of the politics have been swept under the rug, when it became the cause of Western powers. 

Zelensky openly said  that he didn't get almost 70% of the money sent but needs and wants more. 

I am for less war in my great years and if we are going to go to war for oppressed people, we have a whole lot more work to do around the world.  And people have been making themselves rich off that for year. 

Probably more questions than answers, I guess. 

[goose]

All the US/Ukraine/Russia/EU stuff is a proper circus at the moment.

You've got Zelensky saying Trump is "living in a disinformation space" but also trying to keep the US onside because he needs their support. Apparently the US wants 50% of the rare earth minerals from Ukraine.

Meanwhile the European leaders are desperately trying to make themselves look relevant by having their own meetings which nobody cares about.

[goose]

is true that locals call it the Joyo tree? 

Hahaha 100%

[Cabbige Savage]

is true that locals call it the Joyo tree? 

[XKhammer]

It's nice to see the real reasons come out about why there was so much interest in the region though.

Our support probably had as much to do with their mineral riches as it was to do with protecting their borders.

You are completely nuts...seek help

[XKhammer]

Putin apologists make me sick making excuses for his numerous crimes with conspiracy theory bollocks
Putin is clearly a war criminal,a despot on the same level as Hitler and Stalin 
Trump is a moron if he thinks Putin with stop at the Ukraine,he needs to rebuild his smashed up armed forces and will probably attack Ukraine again or Moldova,Georgia,Armenia in a few years time
No way will he take on NATO with or without USA

People who pay disabled people to have sex with them makes me sick as well, joyo.

Horses for courses and all that.

Same here....l class travelling to Bangkok to pay and bonk chick's with dicks very sickening and catching diseases and bringing them back to UK
Not sure which is worse your sexual habits or political views 

[Nutsin]

Multi Billion dollar question is, who is gonna fund Ukraines war effort without the U S backing?
 

[,]

I find it odd that some people can see no problem with two countries negotiating another country’s terms of surrender without that country being not just not involved in the talks but not apparently being consulted over the terms either.

[Lee Trundle]

It's nice to see the real reasons come out about why there was so much interest in the region though.

Our support probably had as much to do with their mineral riches as it was to do with protecting their borders.

[Jaan Kenbrovin]

Rubio just said that as soon on as Trump’s talks with Putin ended he immediately spoke to Zelensky. The only way there will be a peace deal is if it suits all parties in a long standing way. That means the EU also being involved at some point over their sanctions with Russia.

The only reason to be against peace talks is because people simply don’t want the war to end, which means either the EU take over funding it, or escalation with NATO countries troops going in and potentially starting WW3 as Ukraine are incapable of winning it themselves.



 

[WHU(Exeter)]

I know I've mentioned it on here before, but I remember reading a few years ago, about how a Russian convoy had smashed through a US checkpoint in Syria. It never got to MSM as far as I recall at the time, but there was practically no comeback from the US.

I can't picture at all how something like that wouldn't have been a major incident 20 years before and known about worldwide. 

The relationship between the US and Russia is weird now.

[Lee Trundle]

And for that you'd have to involve them in talks.

It's crazy they're not being included, even if their demands are pretty unobtainable.

[goose]

Any peace deal will need the consent of Ukraine, if they chose to accept terms than that is their choice.

If they don't the fighting carries on.

[Far Cough UKunt]

Hitler annexed the Sudetenland, the world accepted it, then he carved up Poland with the Soviet Union's help. 

If you let dictators get away with it once, they will keep doing it.

Those who ignore history, are doomed to repeat it.

It has come to pass.

[Lee Trundle]

How's that then? what exactly is your narrative in the specifics of this deal? Are you suggesting that the people in those areas are more ethnically Russian therefore should be annexed as they probably welcome it? Like Austria in 1939?

The majority of people who live in these regions don't want to be Ukrainian, and even more so they don't want to be any part of Europe or the EU.

So it does make me laugh when you accuse others of not thinking of the people there and want the war and deaths to continue.

That's true for the occupied regions of Donbass but not for the region as a whole, which is what Putin is almost certainly going to want. Even if true why not attempt a peaceful resolution first like a referendum, invading then holding one smacks of despot. If he's shown weakness and gets a peace deal he'll use it to rearm and go again. He's has much longer and wider plans and is most likely emboldened by Trump's thinly veiled free pass to go ahead. This won't stop with Donbas but 'm sure you probably know that 

There were referendums.  Probably not ones that you or I would be confident of the accuracy.

But I'd be confident of the result every time (favouring Russia).  Those people there don't want to be Ukrainian or European.

[Hammer I am]

Think of those living in these areas.


Actually don't, as it goes against your narrative.

How's that then? what exactly is your narrative in the specifics of this deal? Are you suggesting that the people in those areas are more ethnically Russian therefore should be annexed as they probably welcome it? Like Austria in 1939?

The majority of people who live in these regions don't want to be Ukrainian, and even more so they don't want to be any part of Europe or the EU.

So it does make me laugh when you accuse others of not thinking of the people there and want the war and deaths to continue.

That's true for the occupied regions of Donbass but not for the region as a whole, which is what Putin is almost certainly going to want. Even if true why not attempt a peaceful resolution first like a referendum, invading then holding one smacks of despot. If he's shown weakness and gets a peace deal he'll use it to rearm and go again. He's has much longer and wider plans and is most likely emboldened by Trump's thinly veiled free pass to go ahead. This won't stop with Donbas but 'm sure you probably know that 

[Lee Trundle]

Putin apologists make me sick making excuses for his numerous crimes with conspiracy theory bollocks
Putin is clearly a war criminal,a despot on the same level as Hitler and Stalin 
Trump is a moron if he thinks Putin with stop at the Ukraine,he needs to rebuild his smashed up armed forces and will probably attack Ukraine again or Moldova,Georgia,Armenia in a few years time
No way will he take on NATO with or without USA

People who pay disabled people to have sex with them makes me sick as well, joyo.

Horses for courses and all that.

[XKhammer]

Putin apologists make me sick making excuses for his numerous crimes with conspiracy theory bollocks
Putin is clearly a war criminal,a despot on the same level as Hitler and Stalin 
Trump is a moron if he thinks Putin with stop at the Ukraine,he needs to rebuild his smashed up armed forces and will probably attack Ukraine again or Moldova,Georgia,Armenia in a few years time
No way will he take on NATO with or without USA

[Lee Trundle]

"I'm sure British men can't wait to get their legs blown off for this guy (Starmer) then return home and get jailed for asking why their kids were raped to death by Labour-assisted grooming gangs while they were away"

Lifted from X, but it made me chuckle.

[Lee Trundle]

I think it's worth keeping an eye on Nick CANDY.

The bonus of that is that it pushes Holly Vallance back into the limelight .

[only1billybonds]

I make you right Trunds,at some point he (Farage) step down and be a figurehead for reform. Not sure he'd let go of the reins so easily, especially if they are doing well in the polls.

[Lee Trundle]

The best thing Reform can do is get rid of Sir Nige.  He's done his work.

I think there's many out there that would vote Reform if it wasn't for him.

[only1billybonds]

The one positive to come out of the mess that is UK politics is that between the disastrous Tory's  and the detestable Labour Party, Sir Nige is practically being handed the keys to no.10 in little over 4 years time.
Should reform be in power they could well turn out to be as equally inept as the other two but really,would anyone notice the difference?

[Far Cough UKunt]

This whole thing has a distinct flavour of 1930s Germany, I'm just waiting for Chamberlain (Starmer) to come back from Germany waving a piece of paper and declaring "peace in our time".

[Lee Trundle]

Typical Putin apologist drivel, it's inevitable the peace deal the US and Russia propose will involve Putin keeping all the territory he wanted anyway, Ukraine will reject it (why shouldn't they) and the Eu and UK will likely support them.

Don't pretend you're thinking about Ukrainian lives while you fellate Putin and Trump Jaan

Think of those living in these areas.


Actually don't, as it goes against your narrative.

How's that then? what exactly is your narrative in the specifics of this deal? Are you suggesting that the people in those areas are more ethnically Russian therefore should be annexed as they probably welcome it? Like Austria in 1939?

The majority of people who live in these regions don't want to be Ukrainian, and even more so they don't want to be any part of Europe or the EU.

So it does make me laugh when you accuse others of not thinking of the people there and want the war and deaths to continue.