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JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

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camel-with-3-humps
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Ward Prowse JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post camel-with-3-humps »

It's too easy to say 'He's Shit'. 

He played decent football once, but recent performances are woeful. 

- What is going on with his game - confidence, age, league getting faster? 

- Why does he keep getting picked? What is he MEAN"T to do in midfield? 

- Does he have a future here at all under a new manager? 

Please help me understand what is going on here. 
camel-with-3-humps
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post camel-with-3-humps »

Potter has had the best part of a year, but still plays Soucek and JWP in a double pivot. Madness. 

As somebody said here, JWP runs into little pockets, only to pass it four years sideways or backwards.

He's honest, but really should grow a pair of balls - pass forward.

We are in deep trouble if we continue to play such a massive passenger. 
iphammer
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post iphammer »

When he first came to us, he was great, but ever since he's returned from that loan spell to Nottingham Forest, he's been shite. Maybe he can't be bothered anymore like a lot of our players, either way, he needs to be dropped to the bench. 
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Full Claret Jacket
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Full Claret Jacket »

I actually thought he was good in that first 20 mins against Spurs but then we ran out of steam and we got untidy and ragged. For years on this forum there always seems to be a player people want to single out for the problems.
He alone is not the problem, he's been asked to do a role that doesn't match his diminishing skill set. JWP has been professional throughout, he's a positive leader in the dressing room and no doubt has characteristics that Potter thinks we are lacking on the pitch. On the leadership side I would agree he has merit. He runs his nuts off but is not a great tackler, isn't quick and isn't going to push a player off the ball. He is vocal, an organiser and most likely always does what the manager asks him to. 

He just isn't good enough for how we setup. Much the same as the problem when he went to Forest on loan.  I thought Magassa had a reasonable debut so maybe he will come into the team to offer better. We need a proper midfield general though, Bowen is too far up the pitch to be involved and not a shouter. 

JWP hasn't shown any of the ability from free kicks and corners recently that we know he has.
I'd say our coaching of corners both attacking and defending must be shambolic as we look so weak at them. A long way from the Fat Sam days where we were pretty dominant in the box and aerially. 
 
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post ATHammer »

De facto captain while Potter survives and pretty useless at it. On the bench once Potter goes. 
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El Scorchio
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post El Scorchio »

kylay wrote: 15 Sep 2025, 18:26
Eerie Decent" wrote: 14 Sep 2025, 17:19 For a player to have his physique and his lack of pace, you need to have something truly exceptional to your game to be a Premier League starter. He was at one time the best set piece taker in the league, and if he was wrapping in 25 yard free kicks every 5-10 games and causing havoc at corners, you could half suffer the fact he does fuck all, and I mean fuck all, else.

At the moment, he is just a body on the pitch. According to the two virgins who do the Youtube analysis who everyone on here take as gospel, their expert opinion is that he is excellent off the ball tactically, or something like that. I mean, fucking hell.

The only bonus from yesterday was we don't have to see Soucek for a few games. But one thing you can absolutely guarantee is we'll see JWP meandering his way through 90 minutes.
The collapse of his set piece ability is the most baffling thing to me. It's not as though that is something that goes with age. Cresswell could still whip in a fantastic cross, corner, or left-footed free kick all through last season. I remember a bloke in the guardian doing a piece about how brilliant JWP's corners were and how not even Messi could replicate it. Since then, I don't think we've scored from one of his corners. Bowen and Paqueta are more consistent with their delivery now. 
RE corners it doesn't help that Soucek seems the only player in our entire squad who can head the ball toward the goal for toffee. A lot of goals came from he, Zouma or Dawson IIRC, or Antonio. None still at the club. All our CBs are fucking shit in the air, and the rest of them barring Soucek aren't physical or big enough. Probably just he or Fullkrug, but that's only two players to account for which is a piece of piss. Who else is doing any damage at all from a cross? No-one. Boewn is useful for someone his size but he's hardly a massive threat.

We only have seven players in the squad over 6 foot: (according to ESPN which was the first place I found the stat but I assume it's correct)

Soucek 6'3
Todibo 6'3
Mav 6'3
Kilman 6'3
Irving 6'2
Fullkrug 6'1
Magassa 6'1

Only 2-3 of those usually ever start games together or play the vast majority of minutes together, especially if we play two at the back. Likely the best height scenario given the players we'd WANT on the pitch nowadays is to have Mav, Kilman, Fullkrug and Magassa. We ain't a terribly big side, really. 3/4 of the outfield players are 5'10 or shorter. To add, I don;t think any of them are physically dominant aside from Soucek and maybe Mav. The rest get shoved about too much. Magassa may change that a little. He looks like a unit.

So yeah, I think you can definitely point to JWP now being ineffective with corners, but at the same time there's barely anyone who is a threat to get on the end of them. Not one commanding threat aside from Soucek but all you have to do is account for him and we are impotent no matter who is putting the ball into the box.
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kylay
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post kylay »

Eerie Decent" wrote: 14 Sep 2025, 17:19 For a player to have his physique and his lack of pace, you need to have something truly exceptional to your game to be a Premier League starter. He was at one time the best set piece taker in the league, and if he was wrapping in 25 yard free kicks every 5-10 games and causing havoc at corners, you could half suffer the fact he does fuck all, and I mean fuck all, else.

At the moment, he is just a body on the pitch. According to the two virgins who do the Youtube analysis who everyone on here take as gospel, their expert opinion is that he is excellent off the ball tactically, or something like that. I mean, fucking hell.

The only bonus from yesterday was we don't have to see Soucek for a few games. But one thing you can absolutely guarantee is we'll see JWP meandering his way through 90 minutes.
The collapse of his set piece ability is the most baffling thing to me. It's not as though that is something that goes with age. Cresswell could still whip in a fantastic cross, corner, or left-footed free kick all through last season. I remember a bloke in the guardian doing a piece about how brilliant JWP's corners were and how not even Messi could replicate it. Since then, I don't think we've scored from one of his corners. Bowen and Paqueta are more consistent with their delivery now. 
the exile
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post the exile »

Totally agree with Gank about him being a mini Potter. In fact he could be Potter's long-lost son - they even look vaguely alike. Both good at being Mr Nice Guy but both are spent, having somehow lost whatever skills they once had. I don't know if they have gone backwards or the football world has moved on and left them behind.

No problem with JWP's work rate - he certainly puts a shift in. It's his lack of effectiveness and end product that's the issue. His default passing is short, sideways and backwards. If you watch him closely, you'll see that it's not as if he would make a telling forward pass if he could - he's rarely even looking forward. He has no intention of being creative or progressive. How he thinks that is acceptable, God knows. His famous dead ball skills seem to have gone to pot too, even his corners, which reminds me of Noble's back in the day. A couple of years ago his corners were a serious threat, arrowed onto the edge of the 6 yard box and would often find their target, but now they're looped way up in the air and are dead easy to defend. He also adds very little defensively so all in all, he must be dropped. I would play just about any other midfielder in the squad before him.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Massive Attack »

Potter gives me the impression he regularly stands at his Portakabin Office window knocking one out whilst perving on Ward-Prowse doing endless Free Kick routines on his own being 'the last to leave the Training Ground Model Pro'. He probably walks around with cum-stained Tracky bottoms not realising, but I bet some of the canteen staff/Security are fully aware. They probably want him gone sooner than we do because it, I'd imagine.

That's not ITK information by the way so I cannot be 100% certain, but just a good hunch he'd be doing it with how he is. 

 
Gank
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Gank »

You're all overcomplicating it. He's a softly-spoken thinking man's footballer, a mini Potter who is teacher's pet and probably bangs in 25 amazing free kicks every training session without a proper defence.

He's the manager's favourite bloke at the club, of course he's getting picked. For every bad game (and it is every game), Potter sees him curling free kicks into an empty net 4 times a week then has little football philosophy chats with him. They're on the same page, he can understand what Potter's mindset is and they've both become losers on the back of their alliance.
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El Scorchio
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post El Scorchio »

Sir Alf" wrote: 15 Sep 2025, 10:41 Imo Paqueta has to play deeper not as a number 10. Perhaps with a roving role but I would prefer he was deeper as he ended up doing at Forest and linking up with Fernandes who looks to be the only no 8 ball carrier we have.  But its opinions, just that Paqueta failed to an extent in Italy in a more advanced role with his back to goal but was a big success at Lyon as a no 8 deeper with the ball and forwards in front of him. Magassa is still an unknown quantity and I was a tad concerned that he did not look that quick and has that lazy style about him. He wont get the time he had in Ligue 1 in the Prem Lge but he is a big physical unit and well equipped in that sense. He was of course still notably quicker and stronger than JWP and soucek from first impressions but I suppose thats a low bar. 

At Forest with Paqueta deeper we often had 4 in midfiekd and that was a great help.  Potts deserves some minutes in rotation at least. Potter doing the moral cowardice move of playing experience and past reputation over youth. A young player new to the team unlikely to kick up a fuss like an experienced pro who’s used to always starting. He tries to keep “everyone happy” a recipe that dont ever work imo
Magassa Fernandes Paqueta

It's that simple. They are clearly the best three midfielders we have, and that's after seeing Magassa for all of about 10 mins. I couldn't give a fuck if he's 'languid', because he'll clearly be more effective or influential than any other player we have not named Fernandes or Paqueta. It's an inditement on our whole club and especially the chairman that a 21 year old with just over 50 career appearances looks better than the players we've been trotting out week after week for the last 18 months. All he's even got to do to reach that watermark is to run around, tackle, win the ball and give it 5 yards to his midfield partners. Anything more than even that right now is a bonus because that in itself is a huge upgrade. Literally he just needs to put himself about and be physical and a destroyer.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Sir Alf »

Imo Paqueta has to play deeper not as a number 10. Perhaps with a roving role but I would prefer he was deeper as he ended up doing at Forest and linking up with Fernandes who looks to be the only no 8 ball carrier we have.  But its opinions, just that Paqueta failed to an extent in Italy in a more advanced role with his back to goal but was a big success at Lyon as a no 8 deeper with the ball and forwards in front of him. Magassa is still an unknown quantity and I was a tad concerned that he did not look that quick and has that lazy style about him. He wont get the time he had in Ligue 1 in the Prem Lge but he is a big physical unit and well equipped in that sense. He was of course still notably quicker and stronger than JWP and soucek from first impressions but I suppose thats a low bar. 

At Forest with Paqueta deeper we often had 4 in midfiekd and that was a great help.  Potts deserves some minutes in rotation at least. Potter doing the moral cowardice move of playing experience and past reputation over youth. A young player new to the team unlikely to kick up a fuss like an experienced pro who’s used to always starting. He tries to keep “everyone happy” a recipe that dont ever work imo
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El Scorchio
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post El Scorchio »

Has this not been done to death already?

But yeah, he's a case of the mind is willing but the body just can't do it any more. Similar to Noble, I'd say.
Clearly a good club man.

Probably not enough for him to be a mainstay of the team. He's absolutely Potter's blind spot for some reason. You can't just pick good blokes who are 'consistent' rather than the players who are good. If he's getting in over Magassa or Fernandes we're fucked, and Potter will be sealing his own coffin. He can still be a 'club captain' type who doesn't play week in week out like Noble became.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post twoleftfeet »

Guaranteed to start against Palace.

Megassa and Fernandes should be the midfield 2 with Paqueta at 10 and Wilson up top.

Easy this management lark.
dealcanvey
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post dealcanvey »

I think Potters idea of 4 cms on the pitch makes him even worse.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Mad Dog »

He did really well in first 6 months then his form
fell off a cliff when moyes used him as a cdm.  But that was a few yeara ago and now pace has gone from slow to non existant
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Fauxstralian »

Beckham apart from his crossing, free kicks & long range passing was up and down the wing all day 
JWP is just a midfield training cone most of the time 
Would also agree that like many he isn’t helped by Potters team selection & structure 
At a bare minimum you can’t have two plodders like him and Soucek on the pitch at the same time 
We are constantly run off & bypassed which doesn’t help our defenders
Who need all the help going
southbankbornnbred
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post southbankbornnbred »

He seems like a half-decent fella, so I've nothing against him personally. But he hasn't been a good, or even decent, player for several seasons now.

As everybody has pointed out, he is too slow and wants too many touches in increasingly fast and athletic premier league midfields. More than that, the last few managers he has had seem to have coached any positive intent out of the guy. His first pass is regularly sideways and often backwards. He is now painfully and instinctively negative and rarely looks to pass forward as his first option.

Potter, with his (deeply flawed) "safety first" approach of eight men behind the ball (until recently five at the back, keeper, and two deep-lying midfielders) does not help him - because too often the only pass JWP has on is sideways or backwards. Under Potter's PissBall, the spare man or passing outlet is often behind any midfield player. So we just go backwards slowly, but often with the ball. Momentum and intent are crushed.

Genuine question: when was the last time you saw him receive the ball, one touch, and then play a killer pass through an opposition midfield or defence? I can't recall it, and it's because his instinct is now not to look for it. That's either poot coaching, poor tactics or a lack of confidence in your ability.

I think he's a busted flush at the highest level. And I think he knows it, so his confidence is shot. Hence, he hasn't even scored a free-kick for us yet - when he was, genuinely, a very fine dead-ball merchant years ago. And it's not just his free-kicks that are spent. His corner taking is abysmal, too often just hung up in the wind, floating to general areas of the opponent's box. I rarely, if ever, see him whip the ball into real danger zones at head height - so that our bigger defenders and forwards can attack it.

He's shot. He looks like a Rangers player of the future. Or back down to the Championship. Which is a shame, because he had something a few years ago.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post nychammer »

Takashi Miike" wrote: 14 Sep 2025, 17:39 I agree, he's the biggest passenger in the eleven. That he seems to be Potter's Pet makes it even more alarming going forward, as he's no doubt the first name on the team sheet
he's like a poor man's Beckham. Beckham wasn't pacey but he had the ability to make almost every free kick and corner count and his long range passing ability was among the best in the league. if you're bought in for those qualities and cant deliver you are indeed a passenger
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Takashi Miike
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Takashi Miike »

I agree, he's the biggest passenger in the eleven. That he seems to be Potter's Pet makes it even more alarming going forward, as he's no doubt the first name on the team sheet
North Bank
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post North Bank »

Can't blame JWP, look towards the clown that picks him 
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post honky cat »

I imagine he is a good character, trains hard.

​​​​​​I think the question is who he, soucek and the likes of Rodriguez and Irving are keeping out of the team?  I think the answer is players we don't have and should have gone out and bought for the past two or three seasons. Maybe magassa and fernandes will step up but they came in far too late.
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Fauxstralian »

Yes, he scored from a corner at Wolves but hasn’t scored from a free kick for us
I can’t even recall one being close 
nychammer
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post nychammer »

if we take players that weren't nailed on first team at southampton then we'll become southampton. No way JWP should be starting.

I heard (cant recall where) that loaning him out last season went down badly in the dressing room as he's popular with the other players, but that's no excuse to play him over a young hungry prospect like Potts.
Pub Bigot
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post Pub Bigot »

The positives, he’s hardworking and has leadership qualities within the squad. An honest pro. 

Negatives: He’s slow, unambitious, and doesn’t have the physical capabilities to keep up with the current game. 

He’s a Championship player. 
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Re: JWP: We need to talk about his seriously poor contribution to the team

Post chim chim cha boo »

JWP getting picked as a first 11 player is probably the single biggest reason I have lost my faith in Potter.

Now that I hate his non contribution so much I tend to watch him more closely than is strictly healthy but he typifies that certain English player who has always played since he was a little kid, is miles too comfortable, knows how to pal it up with who he has to and is more interested in playing golf and not getting injured. 

It doesn't help that whenever I am unfortunate enough to watch us away on TV when we get a free kick commentators STILL call him the master of the dead ball, despite me not ever remembering him scoring from one in what must be 3 seasons? I seem to remember a corner on a really windy day flying into the back of the net and him being really vague after the match whether he meant it or not.

His whole game seems to consist of running into a bit of space, asking for the ball, getting it and playing it two yards sideways. Then he has a little sprint which I am starting to think he does to get his opta stats up and repeat.

In defence, as we clearly saw yesterday he's nothing more than a rolling bollard. I could probably count the amount of tackles he's put in on both hands. Running back to the centre circle after picking the ball from the back of our net you can almost see him thinking 'well that was a bit disappointing. I'll have to bring that up on Monday at the team meeting'.

I haven't even mentioned his lack of pace, inability to pick a positive pass or his body positioning. We should now come to expect that with JWP AND Tom (who adds a lot more to us but is another midfielder lacking pace) and I have come to expect ANY workman-like oppo being able to get at least 3 goals, barring the odd fluke result for us which it FEELS like is about 1 in 20 games.

Like I say, picking JWP and putting him in the starting 11 is fucking myopic on the part of 'judge me next season after I have a couple of new players and a preseason behind me' and his little pals have to go.
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