The Official Politics Thread (enter at your own risk)

[Come On You Irons]

There. Resident WHO political commentators and gurus can knock yourselves out in here and conduct your endless bickering. All other threads will be locked.

[Far Cough UKunt]

All I'm going to say is, those who don't learn from history (Sudetenland, Austria and later, Poland) are doomed to repeat it.

Putin should not be allowed to permanently claim those territories he's already annexed.

Righto, Cough.

Now, do you have a solution that will satisfy all parties and does not involve continuing the current slaughter? If so please get on the blower to Trump, Zelensky and Putin, because your expertise is needed urgently. 

Or maybe this is a situation that calls for a least worst option. 

Where did I say I have a solution? 
I just posited an aphorism that is as true today as it was in Churchill's time. You know when almost everyone pooh poohed his "warmongering" stance but was later found to be right on the money.

[Nurse Ratched]

All I'm going to say is, those who don't learn from history (Sudetenland, Austria and later, Poland) are doomed to repeat it.

Putin should not be allowed to permanently claim those territories he's already annexed.

Righto, Cough.

Now, do you have a solution that will satisfy all parties and does not involve continuing the current slaughter? If so please get on the blower to Trump, Zelensky and Putin, because your expertise is needed urgently. 

Or maybe this is a situation that calls for a least worst option. 

[Eerie Decent]

That's obviously not going to happen ffs

[Far Cough UKunt]

All I'm going to say is, those who don't learn from history (Sudetenland, Austria and later, Poland) are doomed to repeat it.

Putin should not be allowed to permanently claim those territories he's already annexed.

[Nurse Ratched]

Goose, to many people (we're psychologically and emotionally softer than previous generations) it will certainly have come across as bullying. But also, Zelensky was the instigator in the sense that he suddenly started pouring scorn on the idea of a diplomatic intervention leading to peace. Zelensky has very, very good reasons, borne out of bitter experience, to doubt Putin will negotiate in good faith. But he was supposed to be there to talk about/sign a minerals deal. The peace negotiations were ongoing in the background, but in that press conference he was undermining the process with his comments and inflaming the situation with rhetoric about American soldiers dying in a future war with Russia. It was out of order (but, as I said, rather thrilling) It can't have been easy for Zelensky to be shut out of peace talks with Putin, but his position appears to be intractable: he wants the rest of the world to pay for Ukraine to continue their war against Russia. And for the slaughter to continue. It's a point of view and he has the right to it. Other people, including American voters, disagree. And they're the ones having to pay for it with their taxes.

[goose]

=12.35px"I only saw one side acting terribly" - what a shock

I watched the whole debacle, not selected clips. Found it all rather thrilling and certainly refreshing. Neither Trump nor Zelensky are typical politicians, and as a result opinions were expressed honestly and it got heated, and the world now knows where both of them stand, unfiltered by their spokesmen and uncontamimated by the interpretations of biased media outlets of all stripes.

Contrast it to the smiling, polished greige choreography we usually get treated to when professional politicians hold press conferences and pretend everything's going great. I know you centrist dads love your professional politicians and how dignified they are when they go about doing absolutely bugger all - very expensively - but it's nice sometimes when a bit of honesty breaks out.

Interesting take Nurse which actually made me think.

Watching it made me feel really uncomfortable, it was kind of playground stuff. I also felt they bullied Zelenskyy and used their position of power to make a show of him.

however, I do take your point about realism. It looked a bit like two guys arguing down the pub, maybe politics needs some more ‘real’ arguments and less of the polished performances which are often just for show.

[Takashi Miike]

"Meanwhile, Zelensky remained humble and respectful. Like a true leader."


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[Eerie Decent]

Where it's all going, for a start, is the end to the war in Ukraine, and no WW3.

A big disappointment for some of you, clearly.

[Nurse Ratched]

=12.35px"I only saw one side acting terribly" - what a shock

I watched the whole debacle, not selected clips. Found it all rather thrilling and certainly refreshing. Neither Trump nor Zelensky are typical politicians, and as a result opinions were expressed honestly and it got heated, and the world now knows where both of them stand, unfiltered by their spokesmen and uncontamimated by the interpretations of biased media outlets of all stripes.

Contrast it to the smiling, polished greige choreography we usually get treated to when professional politicians hold press conferences and pretend everything's going great. I know you centrist dads love your professional politicians and how dignified they are when they go about doing absolutely bugger all - very expensively - but it's nice sometimes when a bit of honesty breaks out.

[honky cat]

They should have had Musk's kid running around the room as well.

​​​​​​I don't know where all of this is going with Trump but it's very entertaining. And I expect there will be a "zelensky hovis" thread very soon.

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[Iron Duke]

I only saw one side acting terribly. Trying to bully Zelensky. Be grateful. Say thank you. You’re a dictator. You can’t dictate the negotiations. Why aren’t you wearing a suit? Bow down and kiss our feet.

Meanwhile, Zelensky remained humble and respectful. Like a true leader.

[,]

The more I see of the debacle the more it seems like a happening instigated with the intention of impressing Americans whilst at the same time ignoring the effect it would have on foreign spectators.

Clearly things had not gone well prior to the meet the press assembly and the veep stepped out of the traditional passive role and bush whacked Zelensky. Interestingly both sides stood their ground and did anyone notice the Ukrainian lady with her head in her hands and the very uncomfortable Rubio sitting next to Vance head down and hands clasped?

The relationship between NATO and the USA is irreparably damaged and this will force Europe to take total financial , political and military responsibility for looking after itself. Not before time many will say. 

 

[Far Cough UKunt]

That's a terrible way to behave from both sides, whose ever side your on.

Where's the diplomacy? where's the secretary of state? I'm not sure the VP should be involved at all?

 

[Eerie Decent]

Are all you Trump and Putin supporters happy to be on the wrong side of history?

 

How long do you think that war should go on for?

[THUNDERCLINT]

a proper leader
 

You can't seriously be refering to the coke'd up tracksuited cock pianist?

[Pub Bigot]

Has anyone watched the whole Trump/Vance/Zelensky exchange or just clips?

I watched it all. I think Vance taking him to task escalated and Zelenskyy performed for the cameras. 

While a lot of the world will be frothing at the mouth about Trump’s handing of the situation and embarrassing Zelenskyy, it appears to me that the Ukrainian leader has just bit the hand that fed him and his war, and now his days are numbered. 

[ironsofcanada]

Has anyone watched the whole Trump/Vance/Zelensky exchange or just clips?

[Manuel]

I think that the Dems made Trump and Putin the common enemy these last several years with all this Russia, Russia, Russia nonsense. This is why I think Putin and Trump both want Zelensky out because of his close ties to the Dems. As JD Vance said, Zelensky was in Philly supporting the Dems during the election. The idiot should have stayed out of it altogether. This coupled with all the corruption in Ukraine is a major part of the problem.
Neither Putin or Trump trust Zelensky.

Zelensky will be ousted one way or another and Trump will put in an ally to the Current administration. It’s part of Trumps drain the swamp strategy. 

I could be wrong but it would explain why Trump is negotiating with Putin alone. He knows from experience that anyone connected to the swamp is a major threat to anything he does.

I wouldn’t trust any of them, would you if you were Trump?

Your love of Trump is fucking toe curling, fella.

This Vance character comes across like a right wanker, him and Trump think they're the Mitchell brothers

Mitchell bros ag ag ag ag! 

[Nutsin]

I think that the Dems made Trump and Putin the common enemy these last several years with all this Russia, Russia, Russia nonsense. This is why I think Putin and Trump both want Zelensky out because of his close ties to the Dems. As JD Vance said, Zelensky was in Philly supporting the Dems during the election. The idiot should have stayed out of it altogether. This coupled with all the corruption in Ukraine is a major part of the problem.
Neither Putin or Trump trust Zelensky.

Zelensky will be ousted one way or another and Trump will put in an ally to the Current administration. It’s part of Trumps drain the swamp strategy. 

I could be wrong but it would explain why Trump is negotiating with Putin alone. He knows from experience that anyone connected to the swamp is a major threat to anything he does.

I wouldn’t trust any of them, would you if you were Trump?

Your love of Trump is fucking toe curling, fella.

This Vance character comes across like a right wanker, him and Trump think they're the Mitchell brothers

Mitchell bros ag ag ag ag! 

[Manuel]

I think that the Dems made Trump and Putin the common enemy these last several years with all this Russia, Russia, Russia nonsense. This is why I think Putin and Trump both want Zelensky out because of his close ties to the Dems. As JD Vance said, Zelensky was in Philly supporting the Dems during the election. The idiot should have stayed out of it altogether. This coupled with all the corruption in Ukraine is a major part of the problem.
Neither Putin or Trump trust Zelensky.

Zelensky will be ousted one way or another and Trump will put in an ally to the Current administration. It’s part of Trumps drain the swamp strategy. 

I could be wrong but it would explain why Trump is negotiating with Putin alone. He knows from experience that anyone connected to the swamp is a major threat to anything he does.

I wouldn’t trust any of them, would you if you were Trump?

Your love of Trump is fucking toe curling, fella.

This Vance character comes across like a right wanker, him and Trump think they're the Mitchell brothers

[Sydney_Iron]

Not being allowed in the football forum s politically wrong!

 

 

[Nutsin]

I think that the Dems made Trump and Putin the common enemy these last several years with all this Russia, Russia, Russia nonsense. This is why I think Putin and Trump both want Zelensky out because of his close ties to the Dems. As JD Vance said, Zelensky was in Philly supporting the Dems during the election. The idiot should have stayed out of it altogether. This coupled with all the corruption in Ukraine is a major part of the problem.
Neither Putin or Trump trust Zelensky.

Zelensky will be ousted one way or another and Trump will put in an ally to the Current administration. It’s part of Trumps drain the swamp strategy. 

I could be wrong but it would explain why Trump is negotiating with Putin alone. He knows from experience that anyone connected to the swamp is a major threat to anything he does.

I wouldn’t trust any of them, would you if you were Trump?

[Iron Duke]

Are all you Trump and Putin supporters happy to be on the wrong side of history?

[ironsofcanada]

Oh, and Trumps plan on Canada is fucked up but not the point!

Which one?

The 51st stuff is him trolling Trudeau (and stoking fires amongst a hardcore base) because Trudeau said if Canada were to agree to Trump's trade proposals, we would cease to exist as country.

The economy attacks are the real problem and we have made ourselves incredibly vulnerable to them.

[ironsofcanada]

its clear that Russia and China have a hold on Trump and it will come out sooner rather than later.

It's probably a pee-tape
Or something like that.


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